We recently gave some love to Threadless’ RSS shopping feed and pointed out the Chicago Tribune (finally) profiled the company. More things to like about Threadless:
1. It’s not Web 2.0.
Threadless isn’t about Web 2.0 buzzwords, technology for technology’s sake, doing the VC tango, etc. Threadless is about kicking ass as a real, profitable company and taking care of its customers (the loyalty of customers is the #1 priority).
2. Community…no, really.
A lot of sites pay lip service to the notion of building a community. Threadless actually does it. And it’s not just having a blog or a forum (though the site has those too). Check out the site’s navigation where “Shop” and “Participate” are given equal treatment:
It’s no accident. Threadless isn’t just a place to buy stuff. It’s a place where people do stuff too. The people design the shirt ideas, decide which shirts get made, post to forums, upload photos of themselves wearing the shirts, etc. The result? People are attached to Threadless. As Don Norman says, “We are much more emotionally attached to products for which we feel some involvement.”
Threadless makes people feel like partners, not just customers. That’s why people become MySpace friends with Threadless. They start blogs about Threadless (like this or this or this). They care what happens.
3. It’s playful.
Threadless nails the playful part of the process. Check out the “A song about this tee” MP3 on shirt pages like the one for Happy Hospital. Or how about the Willy Wonka inspired Find the Golden Tag and Win! (“if you receive your order and your shirt has a gold foil tag you win a free tee of your choice!”).
This coy tone extends to copywriting and staffing too. Check out this bit from the coffee-stained FAQ.
Q. How do you become a skinnyCorp employee? How can I become a skinnyCorp employee?
A. You have to be amazing. When we hire, which we don’t do very often, that’s the first thing we look for. Amazingness. Followed very closely by awesomeness, and then insaneosity. You also have to be able to hold your breath for 6 minutes while completing a mile-long sprint. Do you have what it takes?!
When the site asks for a birthdate it follows up with a link that says, “Who wants to know?” instead of the typical “Why do we need this?”
This playful attitude is part of why people get excited about Threadless. Here’s what Kathy Sierra says about playfulness: “Brains love play. Find a way to bring more play (or at least a sense of playfulness) into someone’s life, and you might just end up with a fan. Brains evolved to play, and apparently the bigger the brain, the more likely it is to play. Play turns the brain on.”
4. It’s a real business.
There’s no “build an audience and figure out how to monetize it later” stuff here. Threadless sold $6.2 million worth of merch last year and has pretty much quadrupled in size each year for the past four years. This year’s target = $18-$20 million.
The site’s been diversifying from its main line too. Threadless Select is for “leaders of the design field.” TypeTees is a new take on the traditional “slogan-tee.” There are Threadless Kids tees. Naked and Angry is branching out into ties, wallpaper, and more.
Plus, there’s a subscription revenue stream via the 12 club (a limited edition tee is sent every month for an entire year). There’s a Street Team affiliate program where you can earn points toward future purchases by referring sales or submitting a photo of you wearing a tee. All these approaches wisely spread Threadless’ eggs to different baskets.
5. DIY attitude.
Threadless has avoided partners and investors: “We pride ourselves on being DIY. We started with $500 and have worked our way up to here without any investors. Too many cooks in the kitchen spoils the casserole – especially if some of the cooks only care about how many people it will feed and not how it tastes! :)” It also makes for a great PR angle and is a big reason why the company retains cred with its fans.
6. Quality.
Threadless cares about the details. The shirts are quality. The designs are well executed. Its not just the products, either. The site has lots of nice UI touches too. Check out the way they handle stock information:
They also sound out crisp emails that get straight to the point with photos of the latest tees.
7. Giving back.
Threadless gives something back too. The company teamed up with the Red Cross to raise money: “The designs, chosen from a host of submissions from artists around the world, will be offered through the RedCross.org Store and Threadless.com with $5 from the sale of each t-shirt benefiting the Red Cross.”
On point
Threadless is on point. Real, profitable, human, funny, quality, charitable, and independent. It’s about time more people started paying attention.
Jon Maddox
on 24 Oct 06Threadless sends out the only newsletter that stops me in my tracks during work. While every other newsletter gets a ‘junk’ click, I can’t wait to see what is new from them.
And $10 sales rule.
A
on 24 Oct 06I remember when Threadless started out. It was basically just a way to make members-only and in-joke shirts for a hugely popular forum of industry professionals. It didn’t have to “build an audience first” because it was created essentially to meet the demands of an existing free community operated by the people who own Threadless (whose primary business at the time was as a boutique web design firm). That community was in turn only built to fill the void left after Josh Davis shut down Dreamless…
Threadless is very successful, but without knowing the history behind it, it’s probably not a very good model for a business. Besides, it’s probably a good idea to know that half the stuff the Jakes say in public (unofficial) statements is made up because they think it’s funny. (See the CNN interview, for example.)
Travis
on 24 Oct 06I’ve been a Yayhoorayer and Threadless groupie for 4 or 5 years. Love ‘em. But I just noticed, 15 megs of fame has gone belly up. Wonder why.
A
on 24 Oct 06I don’t think anyone really paid any attention to 15Megs. Lots of people posting, but nobody listening.
Tee
on 24 Oct 06Paying $2,000 for a design and turning it into $100,000 to $450,000 is pretty sweet too. Yay! Hooray! for spec work and contests.
How about some 59/41% profit sharing like the Oddica gents? Hmm… less than 1% at threadless. Hot stuff.
Josh Williams
on 24 Oct 06I just had a tee printed at Threadless, and so has another designer at Firewheel. Speaking for myself, I submit work to Threadless because of the community, not because of the percentage of cash a winning design receives.
I don’t really care how much money Threadless makes off of the design. They are upfront about what they pay you. There’s no deception there. It just so happens that because their buyers are from a built-in community, they sell a ton of shirts. Who’s to say that 49 percent of the profit (not gross, mind you) from another site would even hit $1500?
If you don’t like the setup, you’re right, they’re plenty of other shirt sits offering royalties. To me Threadless is definitely much more about the culture and attitude. It’s not about the revenue split. That’s boring.
A
on 24 Oct 06Interesting that you say it’s about the community.
Much of the community that it was initially launched to serve/take advantage of abandoned the community aspects of the Threadless site. I mean, I know that businesses grow and change, but it’s interesting to note when the customer group you inititially targeted as your most desireable no longer feels represented by you.
Oddica?
on 24 Oct 06If I was a designer who “won” at oddica and I was a part owner of the “41%” I’d be pretty bummed when my “profits” were being eaten up by spending a ton of money on useless throw-aways that are included in every package (including the mailer) rather than actually getting some money out of it. but hey, it’s a great PR angle. (?)
Tee
on 24 Oct 06Josh, it is absolutely about community; except when it comes to spreading the wealth. You have to agree that $1500 cash in your pocket with a winning design vs up to $450,000 (gross) cash in the Jakes’ pockets doesn’t really favor the community does it? Isn’t community also about fairly recognizing the core members of that community?
The guys are grossing almost 7M this year, let’s get real here, eh? When you sell 1,000 tshirts a day I think you can pony up a little more than $1500 for the designers.
I should say I really admire the threadless guys for everything noted in this post. I would say my only issue is that as they grow leaps and bounds the designers that create their products aren’t getting proper compensation.
There’s a gross imbalance between the boss and the worker there.
A
on 24 Oct 06The guys are grossing almost 7M this year
Remember when they went on YH after the CNN interview and said they made up that number (and every other number in the interview)?
Makes you wonder.
Tee
on 24 Oct 06Gang printing and direct-to-plate makes 4/4 full bleed anything dirt cheap. Buttons, postcards and packaging is the least of the expense. And Oddica gives you $1,000 cash (I think). And I bet you they’re not doing 7M this year…
Sangeeta Tomar
on 24 Oct 06Ok, I haven’t bought anything from them, but I love the Playful twist.
I am putting together my online venture for providing legal forms and Business games, but I am not sure if I should use playfulness.
Any suggestions?
Jeffrey
on 24 Oct 06Tee, what tee made $450,000? I’ve worked here for 5 years and unless that one went unnoticed, you have false info. Also, saying “well they made 7m last year, they should give back more!”. Have you ever done work for a client? You get paid based upon the job, not how much the client is worth. We give more money than anyone else, and we continue to make it more. We doubled the prize money in the last year, remember?
The fact of the matter is that there’s nothing we can do or say that will convince anyone of anything besides what they already believe. If you know us, you get us. If you get us, you realize that we are all about our community and we do everything we can to make it more than fair, and better all the time.
Tee
on 24 Oct 06I heard from a recent interview that Flowers in the attic was getting reprinted for a total of 30,000. 30k x $15 = $450k; but it is just an assumption, so sorry. I’m really not trying to slam you guys, just hoping the balance is a little more in favor of designers. You wouldn’t be doing things right if you didn’t have critics, right?
But I certainly don’t agree about price: Doing a logo for a hot dog stand and for Nike would cost the same amount? Even if you consider the labor the same…? I highly doubt that, but I get your argument. Prices are the same in some cases (like selling products) but services aren’t always the same.
PK
on 24 Oct 06I for one believe that Threadless is an example of an actual real community online, rather than the myspaces and such of the world. At least Threadless isn’t all about dating.
David
on 24 Oct 06They could use some extra hamsters for those servers after sale announcements. I timeout too much, but I suppose the silver lining (for them) is the site’s still wildly popular.
Jeffrey
on 24 Oct 06But I certainly don’t agree about price: Doing a logo for a hot dog stand and for Nike would cost the same amount? Even if you consider the labor the same…? I highly doubt that, but I get your argument. Prices are the same in some cases (like selling products) but services aren’t always the same.
Where else can you make more than $1500 for a tee design? And then $300 in a gift certificate and then a $200 12-Club membership on top of it? I used to do tee designs for all sorts of companies when I freelanced for a living. The going price for one is about $300. Sometimes less…
When we started doing the Threadless Select line, I invited ton of very well known artists from around the world and the general concensus is “wow you guys pay a lot”. Not to mention that we only pay $1000 for a Select Design!
I can see your point of view, however. I’d have that point of view too if I was looking at it like you are. Yes, Threadless technically takes in a lot of money. So the obvious answer is that we should pay out a lot of money, right? Well, anyone with a mind for business knows that taking in what we take in, with 25 employees, and rent on a 25,000 sq ft. warehouse, and paying 100% of benefits for all of our employees, and doing matching 401k, and the cost of coming out with 6-10 new tees per week regardless of how the last week’s batch is selling, and selling tees for $10 with no tax for people who come visit us, and having $10 sales at least 3 times a year, and selling our tees WAY cheaper than our competitors (that is, a business of equal size and reach)... we pay a lot. For real.
But again, you’re gonna believe what you’re gonna believe. :)
Brandon
on 24 Oct 06Some people just like to gripe. You see it here A LOT. “Why don’t you do this, you’re so arrogant, add this feature,” blah blah blah. I have seen several comments here that fit. IF they bring in 7 mil a year, why does it matter? There are no guns being put to heads to design shirts for 1500. If you feel its a ripoff, start your own site and pay designers 5000. Would it be nice if there were some type of revenue sharing? Maybe, but if the shirt doesn’t do all that well and you got a check for $100 for the design, you’d be pissed.
Bottom line is someones always got to be the hater. I applaud them for their success and envy them, all at the same time. Same goes for 37s.
Nicole
on 24 Oct 06If I learn nothing else from this blog this year, at least I now know why one of my Threadless tees has a gold tag.
JF
on 24 Oct 06Thanks for that comment, Brandon. It’s nice to hear some reason in these threads.
Skylar
on 24 Oct 06@ 6 I personally find the quality of the normal (Fruit of the Loom) shirts horrible. The fit is badm, material is uncomfortable and color fades fast. I own about 6 of these and they are all the same. Awesome design, bad canvas. The Threadless Select (American Apparel) shirts are great however. If Threadless cares about quality, how about using quality shirts for all your products.
Skylar
on 24 Oct 06And by badm, I mean “bad”.
Jamie
on 24 Oct 06Matt, You forgot #8. They’re based in Chicago. You don’t have to move to the coasts to have an impact. Chicago-based businesses rule.
gwg
on 24 Oct 06If Threadless pays Full benefits to all employes and has 401(k) matching, they can keep whatever profits they would give me from my T-shirt designs.
A
on 24 Oct 06Skylar: they all used to be American Apparel (I think… one of my really early early ones is), but the sizing from AA was wildly inconsistent at the time, which I think is part of why they switched.
Bottom line is someones always got to be the hater.
I hate comments like this. The notion that because somebody has a gripe automatically makes them wrong is just plain stupid.
I don’t have a problem with the Jakes at all. They’re good people and I’ve been on YH pretty much since the beginning, and I’ve supported Threadless since the DESTROY NIFKIN days. But let’s not pretend that just because they’re successful that what they do is perfect or that the community at large isn’t allowed to dissatisfied with some of it. They do good stuff. +1 for them. Some of the stuff they do could be better. +1 for them if they’re willing to listen. -1 to them if they’re going to get all defensive and uppity because somebody pointed out they aren’t perfect.
And that also goes for SvN. “Sense” doesn’t just mean praise.
Dave Rau
on 24 Oct 06We split profits, but we’re super tiny. Speaking as a competitor (barely) of threadless I can’t help but have praise and admiration for their success. Hell, I even submitted a tee design.
It’s all too easy to critique things from the outside perspective; and that’s not really fair because we weren’t part of the thought process that lead to the final product. The design and interface considerations are top-notch; and I’m highly impressed that all employees get 100% benefits, that’s really amazing.
What’s with all these super great companies in Chicago? Dammit!
Travis
on 25 Oct 06As much as building communities is a priority for the Jakes and their crew at Skinnycorp, they’re a business. If they happen to sell more shirts than similar businesses or make more profit per item, more power to them.
Their concept is voluntary contribution not contract work. So the rate they pay and the assumed responsibility on their part simply creates an opportunity to reward you for your effort, and they do so at an amount much higher than a freelancer would ever get paid hourly for illustrating a tee design.
I own a few dozen Threadless tees myself and envy their crew’s creativity and spontaneity. We should all not look to replicate their (buzz word alert) consumer generated approach, but rather create an environment and business that we hesitantly label as work and have the pleasure of enjoying day in and day out.
Matt Gorecki
on 25 Oct 06I had just been through 15megsoffame not too long ago. I found some really awesome bands (reminded me of the mp3.com of old).
However, I’m not really surprised. The UI was clunky and extremely slow (all in Flash if I remember correctly). It was so difficult to really find the kind of music I was looking for.
Does anybody know of any similar projects out there?
mike
on 25 Oct 06“Threadless cares about the details”
Then they should try a spell checker. “tommorrow” ??
:)adam fletcher
on 25 Oct 06I have masses of respect for Threadless. People like to forget that they are a business, yeah a community driven business but still a business. Supply and demand drives price, when you have masses of awesome designs to pick from there is no need to raise the commision sky high, its unlikely to get you better entires. The threadless platform is as good as its gets in this market, if you win threadless you’ll have every smaller tshirt and creative company biting at your heels to work for them. In terms of exposure its an incredibly attractive proposition and if you don’t like it you have tonnes of alternatives.
Leo Kennis
on 25 Oct 06Good list of reasons why, indeed, Threadless is a good company and a good website.
Reminds me of the account-activation email the sent me when I signed up a few months ago. It’s all good and true, but they nail it in the “small print”: How often does an activation mail make you laugh?!Travis Schmeisser
on 25 Oct 06I couldn’t agree more these guys are killing it and deserve every bit of their success. It’s so inspirational to find people doing what they want their way and achieving so much.
Luke S.
on 25 Oct 06Yep, Threadless personify everything that’s great about the web. I love the fact they don’t take themselves too seriously. Or seriously at all :D Fun people, fun products, clever site, and I always enjoy the newsletters! Good times.
k8
on 25 Oct 06Much of the community that it was initially launched to serve/take advantage of abandoned the community aspects of the Threadless site. I mean, I know that businesses grow and change, but it’s interesting to note when the customer group you inititially targeted as your most desireable no longer feels represented by you.
I agree with this. I was heavily involved in the community at one time last year and eventually left because the religious teens took the place over. The Threadless community definitely shifts - somewhat wildly, and perhaps moreso than other communities… to the point where their great UI and site design feel sometimes at odds with the vocal audience in the blog forum. It’s easy to cheer their surface community, and the image they present of themselves as a company team is nothing but cool and fun, but go a little deeper and you see what a strange place it is. As a community building model, I’d be hesitant to use them as a functioning example - they’ve created a thriving one, sure, but it’s its own strange unmoderated beast that lacks the self-controlling factors of a niche core audience that is related to the product (like 37signals has, for example).
Can’t fault their business model, though.
_Del.Real.
on 25 Oct 06Threadless designs are awesome but between paying 15 an 10 for shipping thats a lot of money to a VERY LOW QUALITY TEE, the sizing is bad, in laundry it gets deformed, fabrics feel so poor and don’t fit well, with that I can afford a big brand shirt like Chevignon or Diesel, with not so cool illustrations but presentable for party o college, I’ve used my threadless shirts outside 3 times now they are ugly, JUST TO SLEEP.
Jez Nicholson
on 27 Oct 06They also meet one of my pet theories, which is that it combines the virtual and the physical…...people seem more prepared to pay for physical goods in the long run, whereas the price of pure software degrades. Combine the two and you have low running costs with sustained prices.
mgraham
on 27 Oct 06Whoa. No kidding.
I was turned onto Threadless by a designer friend a while ago and when I first visited I found it immensely cool, but I started reading the blog comments and found myself transported to a mall food court. It would be nice if discussions there were more about critique and design, or at least elevated above swapping Street Team Points like spit, but I don’t know how they could moderate that without alienating customers.
Ryan Waddell
on 03 Nov 06I was dying for a chance to get an “In case of zombies…” t-shirt when they were reprinted. Luckily, they reprinted just recently! Unluckily, I’m not allowed to buy one! My problem is, I’m living/working in Ireland at the moment, but my credit cards are all Canadian cards, billed to my mom’s address. And Threadless, unlike any other online retailer that I’ve dealth with since moving to Ireland, requires that your billing and shipping addresses be in the same country! Why, Threadless, why???
adam fletcher
on 07 Nov 06Counter argument entitled “7 reasons why threadless don’t rule (as much as they used to) here here
beejay
on 10 Nov 06dang, that level of cynicism is not healthy. :/ but you got it all wrong.
- nobody ‘wins’ at Oddica.
- our ‘useless throwaways’ don’t cost a ton of money; they are surprisingly inexpensive, and the customers actually like them, people are happy, and that counts for something, yeah?
- we do actually pay the Artists for their designs, $500, more for a single design than Burton, or Quiksilver, or Hurley, or Busted Tees, or T-shirt Hell, but without the spec work of all five of those.
And $500 more for each and every Reprint. Like Jeffrey said, industry average is $300 to $350.
- we’ve given props to Threadless on many occasions, we admire their entrepreneurial vision and community-building expertise, and we don’t pretend that we are in their league in any way, shape, or form.
- you don’t see the big picture I guess. It’s not about maximizing profit or a making a quick buck — it’s about building a long-term brand in which everyone reaps the benefits. We turned down Hot Topic a few months ago — we could have made an easy $30,000 profit for Oddica by simply shipping all-store buys on two designs. But long-term, it would have been a backwards step. Next stop, JC Penney.
everyone involved with Oddica does this part time, we haven’t taken a dime from it, and we have a long way to go, but in one paragraph, you got it all wrong … so i thought it’d be a good idea to speak up. sorry to digress from the topic. bj \\
Richard
on 16 Nov 06Threadless isn’t about … doing the VC tango, etc.
This amuses me in light of the recent news. “Founded in 2001, skinnyCorp is a global leader in crowd sourcing for the apparel design vertical.” “Insight was founded in 1995 and invests in and partners with growth-stage software and Internet companies, with proven track records, focused on growing and scaling their businesses.”
It takes two to tango! :)
courtney
on 27 Nov 06use my link to buy a threadless shirt http://threadless.com/?from=skeleton+clouds
This discussion is closed.