Continued from Part 1...
| Matt | Trevor Turk 23 Jan 07
Mark:
What’s your favorite part about hosting the GEL conference?
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| Mark | re Gel – tough to name just one favorite aspect, but |
| Seth | it’s the groupies! |
| Mark | one great thing is meeting & seeing the speakers – and i should note that both Seth and Jason gave fabulous talks last year at Gel ‘06 (thanks to both) |
another is meeting the attendees – being an attendee myself, really – learning from everyone else in the room, whether on stage or not |
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...(to tie it into the previous thread) i’m there to create an environment, and hope that the experience that emerges is good |
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| Matt | How do you decide who to invite to speak at GEL? |
| Mark | i try to find a good mix that will "gel" well together – i also like to see if a theme emerges – there’s a lot of research but a good bit of intuition and gut feel as well |
though |
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one thing i learned from richard saul wurman years ago was one way he invited speakers to the TED conference – "invite your heroes." so often i go after people i admire (see prev. comment re seth & jason) |
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| Matt | The TED conference always gets a really amazing roster. |
| Mark | TED and PopTech are titans – Gel is a very different kind of event (at least i think so) |
| Matt | Seth, what are zoomers and why are they important? |
| Seth | A zoomer is someone who changes without stress. |
Human beings evolved to resist big changes. So, change triggers stress. |
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But we built a world that keeps changing faster and faster |
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SO, how to win? |
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Easy, teach yourself to view changes as little things, not big ones. |
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If you change faster than the competition, you will, by definition, be more ‘fit’ for |
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the new environment. |
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Sometimes it comes from the top, of course, but more often, it’s an individual’s choice. |
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and if you work with non-zoomers, get out! |
| Mark | all sounds good to me! |
| Seth | Good, but difficult. |
| Mark | indeed |
| Seth | It’s interesting to watch google |
they desperately want to zoom |
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but as they get bigger, sooner or later they hire non-zoomers |
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hire enough, fail to prune, and the next thing you know… |
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you’re AOL. |
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| Matt | so what’s the solution? don’t get bigger? |
| Seth | which is a fine solution, imho |
| Matt | prune ruthlessly? |
| Seth | also a fine solution |
and the third choice is to do what msoft should have done |
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let the justice department split them up! |
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| Matt | is not getting bigger a real option for Google though? |
| Seth | why not? what’s the point of going to work every day? to have more co workers? |
| Matt | Don’t shareholders expect growth? |
| Mark | i prefer small teams, but then that’s been my whole career |
| Seth | it’s a mythical man month problem. |
| Mark | growth of what… not employee count! |
| Seth | Shareholders expect growth, but always end up bitterly disappointed when the growth |
fades. |
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| Matt | Obvs we here at 37s agree small is great. |
Just seems like a diff ballgame when you’re a public company. |
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| Seth | Google could set the bar higher. Higher on what it takes to be hired, higher for what it takes to stay there, and higher for what it takes to be a viable project. |
And yes, being public is a problem, but that’s not a good excuse. They’ve done a fantastic job of avoiding most public company problems… largely by completely ignoring the shareholders |
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| Jason | Google could go private. I actually think we’ll see more companies making that move over the next 10 years. |
| Mark | i think another pertinent question is what people should do who are at non-Google companies |
again re the Apple example – i think the Google example is instructive, but it’s a very special case |
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| Matt | We talked about underrated earlier. How about the opposite…Is there a company you think really does NOT "get it"? One you just shake your head at? |
| Seth | There are industries that astound me. Airlines sure, but they’ve got problems they can’t fix. I mean folks like the cellular companies. |
why do they establish expectations so aggressively and fail to meet them? Why don’t they lay a framework for their future? why don’t they reinvent the systems while the cash flow is there to support it? |
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| Mark | health care |
| Matt | MH, what specifically about health care? |
| Mark | just listing another sector that is well-established, makes lots of money, and is comically uninterested in the user experience |
| Seth | Healthcare is a great example of the problem with distributed problem solving. It gets you partway, but sooner or later, you need really clear leadership |
For example: who will decree electronic prescriptions? How will we finally deal with iatrogenic problems in hospitals? |
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or my fave, kidney transplants. |
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| Matt | Cell companies def seem to be one area everyone can agree on as sucking. |
| Mark | i’d say most big sectors are like this – which is why being a leader in customer-centered business is often a matter of clearing a very low bar of service |
| Seth | Mark is exactly right. the bar is low, and still no one jumps it |
| Mark | like banking: remember the Commerce Bank speaker at Gel ‘06 last year? they’re a huge success in large part because, drum roll, they have weekend hours. what a concept |
i can’t tell you how many bad – comically bad – experiences i’ve had, or directly heard about, in banks in NYC |
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| Jason | You guys are so right about the low bar. |
I see low bars everywhere. |
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It’s hard not to trip over them. |
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| Mark | there are plenty of good, well-meaning people at all these banks – it’s the lack of customer-centered leadership (re the question at the beginning of this chat) |
| Seth | except, wait |
what about the great bank manager who makes THAT bank better? |
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| Mark | i actually saw that happen |
| Seth | we’re still talking about human beings interacting with other human beings |
and some people refuse to blame their boss |
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they just do it. they treat people with respect |
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| Mark | at bank X i had a great bank manager |
but the system didn’t reward customer-centered bank managers |
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and so in the next re-org, out she went to another division, with another job entirely |
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next bank manager was standard-issue |
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| Jason | I continue to believe the reason more bars aren’t raised is because people don’t think it’s sexy to execute on the basics beautifully. |
That’s what it comes down to. Don’t give me the airplane with the fancy screens in the seats, give me the airplane with a comfy seat and more legroom. Those are the basics. |
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| Mark | basics basics basics – but jason, it just doesn’t make for sexy press pieces :) |
| Jason | It has for us ;) |
| Mark | i’m doing something wrong then ;) |
| Jason | But yeah, you’re right. It’s generally not sexy. |
| Seth | If I had to close this thing with one message to the 37s reader who is reading at work when she should be reading, and who is busy blaming her boss for the low bar and lousy service and the Dilbert world she lives in, it would be this: |
TAKE RESPONSIBILITY! If there’s a problem, fix it. If your job can’t be fixed, quit. How dare you waste your life in exchange for a paycheck. You have high speed internet access, bub, you’ve got no excuse. You don’t live a hovel in Ghana. Go do it!! Pick up the phone and call someone. |
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There. |
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I feel better now. |
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| Jason | I like it Seth. |
| Mark | watch this to see seth give that message http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4… |
| Matt | Good stuff. How about you Mark…If you could give our readers only one piece of advice, what would it be? |
| Mark | oh, for me… |
i’d say just try to become more aware of experience – whether at work, while using technology, while in a store, in a bank, or wherever. i think the more people are aware of good and bad experiences, the better they are at taking responsibility (re seth’s comment) for creating good experiences where they can |
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| Matt | I think Paco Underhill’s book Why We Buy is a great example of this. |
Nothing to do with web sites yet teaches you so much about how to think about experiences. |
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| Mark | SVN teaches you a lot |
| Matt | Great stuff in this chat guys. Thanks so much for participating. Any final thoughts to share or should we wrap up? |
| Mark | this was fun! campfire worked great |
| Seth | Thanks for having us. And even better, thanks for showing the way. The stuff you guys do raises the bar every single day. |
| Jason | Go to GEL would be my recommendation. And that’s not ass kissing. |
GEL is the best conference I’ve ever attended. |
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| Mark | thx |
| Matt | JF, for readers, why do you think GEL is great? |
| Jason | GEL is great for a variety of reasons… Here are a few |
1. High production values. It’s taken seriously and tastefully executed. |
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2. A wide variety of speakers from a wide variety of industries. |
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3. Information and education and entertainment all in one. There’s no better way to learn. |
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4. Inspiration abound. The speakers and the attendees are fascinating. |
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5. It’s comfortable, kind, and focused on the things that I think really matter. |
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| Mark | thx, j! |
| Jason | That’s enough. ;) |
| Mark | whew |
| Jason | But really, it’s a great show and you’ll hear things at GEL you haven’t heard anywhere else. |
You’ll actually learn something. You’ll be inspired. |
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And inspiration and motivation is everything. |
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Seek out inspiration and motivation and you can go far. |
Warren
on 31 Jan 07Seth said on his blog that “no one reads anymore.” Maybe he should stop writing books, then?
Excuse me for not worshiping him.
Greg
on 31 Jan 07Seth and Mark sound very academic to me.
Just my 2 cents.
Non-zoomer
on 31 Jan 07I think Google’s weakness will be their attempt to hire “the best”.
Perhaps a few non-zoomers around the office might help show a different perspective on things, before they die of group think in the style Microsoft made famous?
People are much more than their ability to get with the times.
dave rau
on 31 Jan 07Doesn’t it seem weird that good execution keeps coming up? It seems so basic, yet it’s such a problem. How can this be? Are we all just so worried about the sexy that we’ve been skipping out on the basics?
This chat has inspired me to take a good look at what we’re doing with our little business and see how we can improve the experience and tighten our execution. Seth is always a great read. I really need to buy the rest of his books.
z
on 31 Jan 07bottom line, its about what profit vs what companies can get away with. so if we as consumers tolerate poor service, we’ll be shoved it every day.
and guess what, the bulk of consumer population today shops primarily on price. we are the fatwallet generation.
and good customer service isnt free nor is it cheap.
not that i agree with it, not that i wish it wasnt so. but thats what it is.
the good news, i think (i hope!) the tide is turning. and lets give credit where its due, the 37s are playing a healthy part in this process.
so thank you, please keep it up!
condor
on 31 Jan 07Jason Google could go private. I actually think we’ll see more companies making that move over the next 10 years.
Couldn’t agree more, at least I hope more companies go private. Or at least have more Berkshire Hathaway’s out there, not conglomerates, but capital allocators. Not every company that wants to gain access to public markets needs to go public alone, why not have the capital allocation part be optimized for a group of companies at central level, and have the companies focus purely on operating better.
Karl G
on 01 Feb 07I continue to believe the reason more bars aren’t raised is because people don’t think it’s sexy to execute on the basics beautifully.
While I don’t like paying for insurance, but USAA has the absolute best phone service of any company I’ve ever dealt with. I called them at the wrong number, got transferred, told them I moved, dropped a policy, and transitioned another one in a total of 15 minutes. Every other time I’ve called them has been 5 minutes tops including strange requests like what my driver’s license number was two states ago. I only give them my account info once and the only additional info I have to supply is the ID check when I get transferred, which I’m fine with.
Why can’t my internet and cell phone providers do that?
37s reader, reading at work
on 01 Feb 07If I had to close this thing with one message to the 37s reader who is reading at work when she should be reading, and who is busy blaming her boss for the low bar and lousy service and the Dilbert world she lives in, it would be this:
TAKE RESPONSIBILITY! If there’s a problem, fix it. If your job can’t be fixed, quit. How dare you waste your life in exchange for a paycheck. You have high speed internet access, bub, you’ve got no excuse. You don’t live a hovel in Ghana. Go do it!! Pick up the phone and call someone.
I’d like to point out to Seth that this is a lot harder than it sounds, and it has a lot more to do with luck than anything else.
I’m in this position for the third time. My job can’t be fixed: the customer-facing execution is the last thing any manager cares about, and not only is there no support for improving it, there’s active resistance. It’s obviously the cause of the company’s problems, but rather than fix it, upper management tries ideas in a shotgun approach, firing off a dozen initiatives in the direction that they think the problem is, and well, you can’t hit the broad side of the barn if you’re aiming at the fence.
The problem is, I’ve known about this for more than six months, and I’ve been applying for other jobs in that time. (I knew about during the interview, to be honest, but I needed those paychecks, and I had hope that I could improve the system, as it’s a small company.) I don’t want to move somewhere that I can tell will be just as bad; I don’t want to move somewhere that won’t be there within six months. And the number of companies that are willing to hire remote workers is vanishingly small. To be sure, they’re some of the ones I’d want to work for most, but I’m probably not even aware of 9/10 of them.
Finally, I’ve thought about starting my own business, but in a phrase, I’m a task-focused introvert, and that was what killed my last attempt at starting a business. I have all the technical skills to get the job done, and even the social and communication skills to interact with management, but I am horrifically bad at rainmaking, and my attempts at drumming up business mitigated my burn rate, but after six months it was clear that the business was not likely to be sustainable.
I don’t think there are any simple solutions; this is just a vent/rant. I’d like very much to take responsibility, but if I try to fight the system here, I wind up burning out (which is pretty much the state I’m in, as you can probably tell); if I try to find a system I can work within, the search comes up empty; and if I try to go it on my own, I wind up bankrupt.
Brandon
on 01 Feb 07I’ve wondered about the cell phone companies for a while now. Not only are they hard to deal with, but their service usually ends up sucking.
I hate having my calls dropped. Not because I’m so important, but because its annoying. While I’m amazed at the idea of the cell phone and how well it works, I’m more amazed that some company hasn’t found a better way to address this. It seems like one of them should step up and say, ok every network has dropped calls. We realize this, so if you get disconnected, and redial the call within X number of seconds, you will get rebated the minutes of the first call. That may not be the exact answer, but it seems like someone would take it on. Instead, we all sit and take it. How would we feel if periodically, driving down the road, our engine would start and stop? Or worse, we take it in to get it repaired, only to continually have the same issues?
The contracts are another issue as well as just general customer support. I hate that the solution to fixing my broken phone I bought new, with a refurbished phone is just annoying. Give me a new sexy phone of equal value and don’t make me buy the lame equipment insurance to do it.
This discussion is closed.