[Fireside Chats are round table discussions conducted using Campfire.]

The Chatters
Jacob DeHart (skinnyCorp/Threadless)
Jeffrey Kalmikoff (skinnyCorp/Threadless)
Zach Klein (Connected Ventures/Vimeo)
Jakob Lodwick (Connected Ventures/Vimeo)
(Moderated by Matt from 37signals)

Topics
Our chatters — old friends btw — discuss Threadless, Vimeo, retail stores, video, community, Silicon Valley, YouTube, Yahoo, and a lot more.

Jacob
so lets get down to business
Jacob
A/S/L ?
Zach
24/M/Brooklyn
Jakob
25/m/NYC
Jeffrey
13/f
Jacob
18/F/Chicago got pics?
Matt
So, what are y’all working on these days?
Zach
Zach
(FYI, I’m listening to Die Romantik while chatting—they’re a great local band I saw for the first time last night)
Jeffrey
All of our work is secret
Jakob
Im trying to get on To Catch A Predator but every time I show up it’s an actual 14 year old girl
Zach
A site for sharing videos you make with friends and fam.
Matt
For our readers, how is Vimeo different than YouTube and other video sharing sites?
Jakob
YouTube is for watching TV shows
Jakob
Vimeo is for sharing videos you shoot with friends and family
Jacob
I’m currently redoing iparklikeanidiot.com, we have some special secrets coming up and is requiring a complete overhaul
Jacob
Vimeo is really awesome, to me YouTube vs Vimeo is like CafePress vs Threadless
Jakob
Thanks Jacob D!
Zach
Jacob, how much Threadless work do you do on a day to day basis?
Zach
I envy all the time you have to do personal projects
Jeffrey
so do i
Jacob
Actually I’m weaning myself off of Threadless, Jake is going to do most of the major programming. I still pop my head in and suggest/implement features. Most recently I made it so adding an item to your cart is done with "AJAX", that way it keeps you on the product page so you can keep shopping.
Matt
what do you find most interesting about each other’s companies?
Zach
I love their space!
Jakob
I like that SkinnyCorp is totally uncompromising
Jakob
and they don’t give a fuck about money
Jakob
yet somehow they make lots of it!!!! how counterintuitive!
Zach
I think they do a good job making lots of money without compromising.
Jakob
that’s what I meant to say
Jeffrey
i like how you can get a good feel for who CV is by looking at their projects
Jeffrey
like, college humor isn’t just a site which fills a niche and makes money. you can tell that the site would probably exist as a means to have a good time whether they had 10 users or 10 million
Jakob
Zach and I are only working on Vimeo now, not CollegeHumor
Jakob
we have 9 full time employees
Zach
Yeah, did you guys hear? We spun off!
Jeffrey
i did hear that!
Zach
(not entirely, but physically!)
Jeffrey
what’s better about your jobs now?
Jakob
I can come up with ideas and other people program them
Jakob
that’s better because I’m like 1/3 as good at programming as they are
Zach
I work on my dream project.

Jacob
What are the plans for vimeo, the site is 100% free right now, will it always be?
Zach
Yeah, totally.
Zach
We intend to stay ad-based. At some point, we might offer additional pay-services.
Jakob
we want Vimeo to be like this:
Jakob
Bunchofpunks
Jakob
wrong image
Jakob
whoops
Jakob
Bigwheel
Jakob
we want Vimeo to be like this:
Jeffrey
haha
Matt
i think you want to ride the tricycle on the mohawk.
Jacob
Are you worried about vimeo growing too fast and not having a strong enough revenue stream to support it?
Jakob
Jacob, are you talking about bandwidth costs?
Jacob
yea
Jacob
i am
Jakob
Frenchcrullersinjacket
Jakob
Bad
Zach
Nah, we’re confident our growth is scalable.
Matt
Have you guys intentionally tried to keep Vimeo on the down low so that it can grow slowly? Or do you want max traffic there asap?
Zach
At first we did, because were mooching CH servers to host it.
Zach
But Uncle Barry Diller [Head of IAC] gave us the green light to spend some family money to upgrade our setup.
Jakob
if we wanted max traffic, you would see viral vids and TV shows on the home page
Jakob
we want lots of people using the site, but using it for what we consider good reasons
Jakob
as long as people are uploading their own videos, we’re happy.
“If we wanted max traffic, you would see viral vids and TV shows on the home page. We want lots of people using the site, but using it for what we consider good reasons.”
Jeffrey
you always hear people say "our site will be the (fill in the name) killer". i don’t expect you guys have plans like that. how do you see yourself fitting in the same realm as youtube?
Zach
I wish we could be more forthcoming about some of monetization ideas—but video-sharing is even more cut-throat than t-shirt sales! We have to keep mum about some stuff.
Jacob
You should have commercials every 5 seconds in the vimeos
Matt
Threadless: Tell us about your retail store plans.
Jeffrey
our plan is like this
Jeffrey
Cash_advance
Jeffrey
ok honestly the plan is sorta a secret
Jeffrey
but
Jeffrey
the idea is that we don’t want to do a traditional retail store at all
Jeffrey
most people think our idea is backwards, but really the store exists to drive traffic to the site
Jeffrey
we want people in the store to have a similar experience to being on the site: hang out, learn something, buy something
Jeffrey
the store will have very limited product
“The store exists to drive traffic to the site. We want people in the store to have a similar experience to being on the site: hang out, learn something, buy something.”
Jacob
1. Build online business 2. Open Retail Store 3. ??? 4. Profit
Jakob
maybe they think the idea is backwards because it’s interesting
Jakob
and they are boring
Jakob
and their old, boring brains can’t think in new terms
Jakob
and they only like ideas that are proven moneymakers
Jakob
will it be like a library?
Jeffrey
more like a community center
Jakob
that’s SO COOL
Zach
I don’t know—this sounds alot like what Starbucks tried to do! Build a million stores to get a million new users to their website.
Jakob
can we just take a second and agree how cool that is?
Jakob
this is a MULTI-MILLION DOLLAR BUSINESS and their next move is to build A COMMUNITY CENTER?!
Zach
(totally cool)
Jakob
HELLLOOOO???? is anyone else thinking anywhere CLOSE to those terms?
Matt
agreed.
Jacob
[smacks jakob]
Jeffrey
haha
Matt
and gallery-ish too, right?
Jeffrey
it’s gallery-ish in that we’ll have gallery openings for certain shirts
Jeffrey
imagine a cool museum, where under the art, you could buy a print right there
Jeffrey
and that print will keep your nipples warm
Matt
So both CV and Threadless recently hooked up with outside companies – InterActiveCorp and Insight Venture Partners. How are things different now that there’s someone else involved?
Jeffrey
jacob now has a LV messenger bag
Jeffrey
exactly the same for us
Jacob
Life after Insight is great. They pretty much stay out of our business unless we ask for help. We usually have a call with them every week or two and they shoot us emails a couple times a week with ideas on open issues.
Jeffrey
i actually like how proactive they are with ideas
Jacob
They’re really helping us focus on our goals for the next year which is exactly what we wanted
Jeffrey
and i think it’s crazy how they know everything. like if i comment on a blog about threadless, i’ll get an email from one of them being like "great comment…"
Jeffrey
sometimes it’s a little scary!
Zach
It’s great. They stay out of our hair, until we need their help with accounting and legal stuff.
Matt
Any sort of backlash to the deals from your respective communities?
Jakob
no
Jakob
they don’t think in those terms.
Jeffrey
people are mostly just curious and worried it would change things
Jeffrey
but no backlash
Zach
Honestly, things have only been better for our users and fans.
Zach
We’ve been able to start scaling quickly.
Jakob
we don’t really talk about them, so they’re basically invisible to our users.
Jakob
our users didn’t care about the business stuff before the deal, either.
Jacob
the only backlash was our community found the profile pics of Jeff and Kobi and made fun of them, otherwise they’re really excited for us
Jeffrey
some people accussed kobi and i of being related
Zach
On the CollegeHumor side, we hired an ‘original content’ staff to start making our own CH videos
Zach
and on Vimeo, they helped us spin off and stand on our own feet.
Matt
You guys both have thriving fanbases…What’s the secret to building a successful community? Where do other sites fuck it up?
Jakob
ok, here’s the secret:
Jakob
don’t make the pursuit of money your top priority. work hard and listen to people.
Jeffrey
how are we defining "successful community"?
Matt
having a large group of people who feel passionately about your site/product(s).
Jeffrey
because i tend to define a successful (web) community by it’s similarities to a real community, offline
Zach
Giving our communities a personality has been important for us.
Jakob
I think you have to be part of the community!
Jakob
The people who create it have to be part of it!
Jeffrey
yes
Jakob
You can’t just build a community and expect people to use it, as if you’re buying a fishbowl
Jeffrey
going further than that, you have to have more than presence
Jeffrey
you have to understand that the more successful your community is, the more you’re outnumbered
Jakob
go on
Jacob
You definitely need to be part of the community, you also need to take into consideration the fact that you as the owner are still only 1 member out of the thousands and thousands in a community, and the opinions of all the others are just as valid as yours
Jacob
and if you listen to your community they’re going to respect you, and if they see the site evolve because of their suggestions they’re going to have that feeling of ownership
“The more successful your community is, the more you’re outnumbered.”
Jeffrey
i think also understanding the components of community helps in nurturing growth
Jakob
yeah!!!
Jakob
I think of these websites as places. Like, Threadless is sort of an online city
Zach
With a variety of public and private spaces.
Jakob
in a good city, the mayor walks around the sidewalks and eats at local cafes, talks to people on the street, works in a local office building
Jeffrey
only in threadless city, we have a ban on outdoor ads
Jakob
yeah, a little fascism is ok
Jacob
I like this "you have to understand that the more successful your community is, the more you’re outnumbered"

Continued in Part 2.